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Review on NSW event operations
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Valen
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Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 4435
Location: Sydney


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Theres 2 issues your having andrew and i think they are getting conflated.

I think i can see a potential improvement from your comments. If somebody is forefitted against we should weight the draw against them getting a bye at any stage after that. Doesn't help if somebody gets a bye then a forfeit but its better than nothing.
Try to have the same number of matches for all people. It is unfortunate what happened to you, you really got the bad end of the stick with that sequence of bye and forfeit. Most people had 4 fights which is 2 more than *most* people would have with an elimination system, individual experiences may differ, consult your doctor if symptoms persist.

Unfortunately I can't think of a way around that. All systems have byes and forfeits.
if we have 4 rounds in a day, its entirely possible if shitty for a person to only get 2 matches, and regardless of the judging system in use its hard to come up with an accurate determination of that bots "fighting power" if you will. I'm open to suggestions on how to improve that.

The points side of things is subjective, I agree. This behaviour was by design. It was introduced to allow creative bots a chance at progressing even if they didn't win. At the time everybody was deathly afraid of the evil spinners turning the sport into who could build the hardest brick or most expensive spinner. If we want to change how points are allocated or just go to purely win/loss rates then that's also fine.
Ditching the round robin and going just to eliminations means less fights for most people. On average each bot will get less than 2 fights a day, assuming some losses due to attrition.

It could be argued that building a wedge means you are building a less exciting robot, as such you must depend on winning each round if you want to win the overall comp as your not bringing your own excitement to the match you depend on somebody else to do that for you. Unless you build a wedge like cobra that was able to supply its own. I think the general community consensus is that this is a desirable outcome? If you feel differently now is the time to voice it.


To argue specific points.
" Spinners are more exciting then a well driven wedge but a well driven wedge can win most matches depending "
exactly, and we try to give both styles access to the finals, so either win reliably or be spectacular.

you Vs glen was exciting, it contributed strongly to your score even though you lost the match.
You vs noodler was well dull tbh i think we can all agree with that, but his bot was within the rules, so its not really anybodys fault but yours if you can't operate effectivley against him. In any event you won.

now the bye and forefit suck in combination.
but lets look at some possibilities.
You get drawn against epoxy stingray. its a dull match but you win your win ratio becomes .75, not good enough to go through as 2 other bots were undefeated.

you go up against a spinner and get a decent score win or loose.
you get into the finals pushing shredder out.

So really the take away is to get into the finals with a wedge you need to either win every match or have a lucky draw that shows off your strengths. I can't see how another system is "fairer".

"In my eyes this is entertainment in a form but the bottom line for me is it is COMPETITION. I won one match, lost one match and the earliest i found out of what was happening was when they announced the final."
I'm pretty sure you would have been told about the bye and when you were fortified against you also knew about it. All the other systems running other than double elimination would give you the same result. 1 win 1 loss and 2 no competes = a "rank" of 50% if you know a better system (for everybody) I'm happy to hear about it, seriously if you have suggestions on how to improve it everybody wants to know.

"Also i keep on people as long as some of there robot still moves to push the action and keep entertainment up." right so entertainment is important then, so having two wedges nudging each other for 3 minutes is not the desired outcome. Your dislike of not getting into the finals is at odds with your desire for entertainment, if you want to *win* then act in a way to do so. If you want to have fun then thats fine too, but achieving both goals may be difficult.

"This is nothing personal but as a competitior i feel it could have been handled better, explained better or looked into more. My way of looking into it is the guy who wins is the guy who wins the most, not the guy whos design tickles the fancy of the three guys punching in some numbers."
Right, so win *every* match, not just the matches that are against the robots your bot is good against if you want to go into the finals.
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Post Wed Aug 01, 2012 12:25 am 
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marto
Experienced Roboteer


Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 5459
Location: Brisbane, QLD


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So just got back to some internets and seeing this thread makes me feel pissed off and disappointed.
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Steven Martin
Twisted Constructions
http://www.botbitz.com

Post Wed Aug 01, 2012 12:44 am 
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Nick
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Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 11802
Location: Sydney, NSW


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Sort of OT: With my house reno plans, I need to move the ant arena as there will soon be no place to store it here. Would any one like to A) take it over permanently and do whatever you like with it, or B) store it for 6 to 8 months until my new place is all sorted out?

I can bring it over to your place any evening or weekend and if you want to put in the effort, I am totally cool about mods, repairs or how its used. If I can't find a new home, I will have to junk it or leave it out in the weather to rust.

Post Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:46 pm 
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andrew



Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 3110
Location: Castle Hill, Sydney. N.S.W


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As a last resort I'll store it in my single car apartment garage usually inhabited by a car. If nobody else can store it and it's gonna get scrapped I'll make room and find a spot for it.
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Post Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:14 pm 
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dyrodium
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Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 6476
Location: Sydney


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I can take it for a little while, and am happy to host antweight comps. Laughing I really need to find a new home for this beetle arena roof tile I've got though... Shocked It's just a bit too large to store properly anywhere! Rolling Eyes Plus huntsmans seem to think it's some kind of luxury hotel, or something... Razz
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Post Thu Nov 29, 2012 1:03 pm 
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Knightrous
Site Admin


Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 8509
Location: NSW


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Dump it at Glen's, he can finally move out and live in it Razz
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Post Thu Nov 29, 2012 2:52 pm 
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Valen
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Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 4435
Location: Sydney


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I can store it along with the arena for an indeterminate period of time, The wife's sister may be moving in next year and that would entail making that room liveable once again, Whilst I'll do my best to encourage her to have large quantities of steel in there I doubt she would go for the current robot arena.
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Post Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:55 pm 
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