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NSW season 6 2009
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andrew



Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 3110
Location: Castle Hill, Sydney. N.S.W


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The addition of the x-block spiced things up a tad

I think some form of a pit would make it a little more fun

Only issue is how can it be done in a way that if scissorhands and orbit went in it wouldnt trash alot of things
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Post Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:01 pm 
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Knightrous
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
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Location: NSW


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Line the inside of the pit with conveyor belt.
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Post Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:20 pm 
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Nick
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How come this just got raised in the NSW event thread? I'd think that *on balance* our fights are more violent and exciting than anywhere else in Oz Confused

I am not keen on eliminating tap-outs for three reasons: A) My bot can do a huge amount of damage in 10 seconds to a stationary bot and I would feel rather guilty about taking advantage of that. 10 Sec of free hits could potentially wipe out hundreds of dollars and months of work. If high power spinners were allowed free reign, we would get the 'gourmet damage' for video, but run out of bots very quickly.

B) Some bots (mine again) cost quite a bit in materials. I can just about afford a spare Mag motor if it gets sawn in half, but some guy in school doesn't need his entire income for 6 months trashed in 10 sec.

C) No tap-outs favour low damage matches with two nudge-bots without adding anything to boring matches, while penalising the loser in a high damage spinner match.

I think tap-outs need to stay but we could make them more expensive so that if you are down but not quite out, you will think very hard about tapping prematurely.

Passive arena hazards are really not going to help make matches more exciting - they will only serve to reduce the the length of ALL matches. An active mobile hazard like a house flame thrower bot would make things much more exciting, but would still skew the scoring.

How about an entirely new idea - the double jeopardy? If BOTH builders opt in, we have some form of active interference or no tap-out and they are rewarded with a bonus score for both the winner and loser. This is different because they have both opted for added risk.

Post Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:19 pm 
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Glen
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yeah i think something to discourage a tap out when its not totally neccessary would be good. just sucks a little if someone looses a weapon and decides to tap out when it could turn out to be an awesome fight ala IG vs plan g


quote:
How about an entirely new idea - the double jeopardy? If BOTH builders opt in, we have some form of active interference or no tap-out and they are rewarded with a bonus score for both the winner and loser. This is different because they have both opted for added risk.


i like it Cool
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Post Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:32 pm 
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Nick
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OK, here is a refinement to the above idea - both competitors opt in and the AUDIENCE decides when someone taps out Idea

This is good for two reasons: the victor doesn't have to feel guilty about continuing to dish out damage too long and it gets everyone more involved.

This still needs some work; its not going to improve wedge vs wedge matches unless we add a house bot or something similar. Plus, I still don't know how this turned up in the 'Sydney spinners' thread Confused

Post Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:50 pm 
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RogueTwoRobots



Joined: 12 Jan 2008
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Location: Irvine, Scotland


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In the UK we don't have a set tap-out rule but if someone's sustained a lot of damage yet can still move, or if vital costly electronics or other components are exposed by having a panel ripped off and you fear they might suffer next, then simply saying that you wish to cease and surrender the victory is respected and the attacker refrains from continuing their assault.

In terms of replacing the tap-out rule with a 10 second count-out; the general consensus seems to be that a lot of damage can be sustained in that 10 seconds but there's a simple solution. If the robot has visibly stopped moving and is being counted out, then they are no longer a threat to your robot. No need to continue smacking them with a spinning disc/bar; just let them be counted out and take the victory. If you want to prolong the match, kill your weapon power and push them about for a bit (a victory shove Smile) or push them into the new pit that you seem to be in favour of. I agree with you on that one - pits are good, especially if you aren't a crap driver Razz

Hope you don't mind me sticking my nose in on this, seeing as I don't compete with you guys, just thought I'd add my opinion. I'd like to move to Australia one day so hopefully I can come along and give you a taste of Scottish robotics Smile
I don't do tap-outs (its Robot WARS after all!) so you're all welcome to try and smash me to bits. Just look out for my 4.2kg spinning drum though Cool

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:23 am 
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Valen
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I haven't seen anybody tapping out after loosing a weapon.
Most of the time when somebody looses the weapon their whole bot has been hosed in some form or another

Russell had the idea of giving the crowd a "tap out" button
IE if its too boring the crowd/judges can vote to kill the match and nobody gets any points
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Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:40 am 
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Rotwang
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quote:
Originally posted by terminaldamage:
In the UK we don't have a set tap-out rule but if someone's sustained a lot of damage yet can still move, or if vital costly electronics or other components are exposed by having a panel ripped off and you fear they might suffer next, then simply saying that you wish to cease and surrender the victory is respected and the attacker refrains from continuing their assault.

In terms of replacing the tap-out rule with a 10 second count-out; the general consensus seems to be that a lot of damage can be sustained in that 10 seconds but there's a simple solution. If the robot has visibly stopped moving and is being counted out, then they are no longer a threat to your robot. No need to continue smacking them with a spinning disc/bar; just let them be counted out and take the victory. If you want to prolong the match, kill your weapon power and push them about for a bit (a victory shove Smile) or push them into the new pit that you seem to be in favour of. I agree with you on that one - pits are good, especially if you aren't a crap driver Razz

Hope you don't mind me sticking my nose in on this, seeing as I don't compete with you guys, just thought I'd add my opinion. I'd like to move to Australia one day so hopefully I can come along and give you a taste of Scottish robotics Smile
I don't do tap-outs (its Robot WARS after all!) so you're all welcome to try and smash me to bits. Just look out for my 4.2kg spinning drum though Cool



The Tap out situation is a Sydney phenomenon. Down south it works as you describe.
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Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:27 am 
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Nick
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What's this "Sydney phenomenon" I can't recall tap-outs being much different anywhere I have had a match Confused

Can someone explain how a pit makes a match more exciting? A bot can be pushed into it (possibly slightly exciting) or it can drive or recoil into it, neither particularly exciting. All you can definitely say is that it will decrease the average time of matches even further. It also encourages strong, slow pushy bots as they now have a way to incapacitating their opponent. I seem to recall everyone saying that two slow 'nudge-bots' makes for the most boring type of match.

If we really want excitement, we need to have more active weapons. In Spockie's analogy, we need less rock and more scissors Laughing

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:51 am 
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Glen
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quote:
Can someone explain how a pit makes a match more exciting?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OdsnpByoJ4 greatest fight of all time

im just finding these 20 second long oh you hit me my weapon exploded out tap out time intollerably boring, but if everyone else thinks otherwise then drop the whole convo.

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 11:35 am 
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Valen
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Joined: 07 Jul 2004
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but that's it its not "my weapon exploded i tap out" its "my robot broke I tap out"

that's the whole point, If you want fights to last 3 minutes then ban weapons.
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Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:58 pm 
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Nick
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@ Glen:OK there was a pit, but it only featured for a few seconds - the two competitors and the house bots made it exciting for me, not the pit. I guess I just don't get it Confused

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 4:05 pm 
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Glen
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oh wells difference of opinion, but i expect super mega awesome matches in lieu of any changes Razz

anyway off on a tangent whats everyone planning to bring for the first round? any new machines on the horizon?

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 5:04 pm 
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Nick
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Same old boring mega destruction bot for me, I'm afraid Smile

I am all for changes, but I think we can do better than just a pit. Changing the tap-out rule a bit and a not too destructive house bot both sound good.

If we did a house bot, how heavy and what configuration should it be? I'm thinking something lightweight or a little heavier, VERY solid and low maintenance and a weapon that is very visual but not instantly fatal, like a hammer or a small flame thrower.

I can donate some colson wheels and 300 watt scooter motors for a project like that...

Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:42 pm 
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dyrodium
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I'll be bringing a lifter (if the ibc if fixable) and a new drumbot. Twisted Evil
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Post Fri Feb 13, 2009 6:57 pm 
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