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Nick
Experienced Roboteer
Joined: 16 Jun 2004
Posts: 11802
Location: Sydney, NSW
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Is eigth sets of batteries a guess or based on maths? For an eight way roundrobin, which is the most bots we can fit into the time, there are 7 rounds with four matches in each round. We can schedule each bot so they fight at fairly regular intervals and with 15 minute spacing the absolute worst is a single 30 minute break with the average being 45 minutes. That is about what we already have near the end of the day with double elimination so we should all be able to cope.
With the batch system there will still be pauses between matches and I can't see it taking less than 5 minutes to vote, clean out the previous match, get the new bots in and powered up, clean major debris etc. Lets assume we are super efficient and do it in two minutes, which means there is a match starting every 5 minutes. Each round will still have four matches (I'm comparing the same 8 bot scenario) and the batch will take 18 minutes from start to finish - pretty damn intense!
We then have a 30 minute R&R break, rinse and repeat. That means from the start of one batch to the next is 48 minutes, assuming super efficiency and no forfiets. I put that into a spreadsheet and we could fit in an amazing 10 rounds in a day . That doesn't include a lunch break so let's say just 9 rounds. The trouble with this is that given our slackness it just isn't possible to reliably keep to a two minute break and if you want to watch all the matches (and who doesn't?) then you get the same or less time for R&R on average than with the constant 15 minute schedule. If we work the mining out with a more realistic 5 minute break between matches, then a batch takes 27 minutes and we can fit 8 rounds in a day with a 30 minute lunch break. More realistically, you would do 7 rounds and have a longer break, plus use the spare time to take up delays.
When you compare a steady 15 minute schedule with a batch system, they are remarkably similar except that the 15 minute schedule has a more relaxed changover period during which we can vote, clean the arena and get the next bots loaded in. With the batch schedule the recharge & repair time is still no better and usually worse, plus Sarge will be yelling at us until he bursts an artery.
If anyone wants to check the spreadsheet with the comparisons, just ask and I will email it.
Please don't think I am being an arena Nazi, I just want to find the best way to pack more matches into an event with the least complication and stress. What everyone has to realise is that to have more matches, we HAVE to have less time between them. We can average it out or we can batch it up, but there will always be less time. If we can't get organised enough for that, we just have to accept that perhaps the current system is better for us.
What say you? _________________ Australian 2015 Featherweight champion
UK 2016 Gladiator champion
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Tue May 30, 2006 2:22 pm |
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Spockie-Tech
Site Admin
Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 3160
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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If you want to run a tight schedule, It simply comes down to the professionalism of your compeitors.
After someones bot has been removed from the arena after a fight, that person should *not* be leaving their pit table until their bot is ready to just turn on and fight again.
No wandering around talking to people, watching other matches, taking photos of the damaged opponent, going for a bite to eat or *anything* else. The batteries should go straight on charge, and the robot should be tested and ready to go. If your bot is not ready for its next fight before you get distracted, you are risking a forfeit or an event holdup.
I realise that sounds harsh and takes away some of the socialising and fun of chatting to other competitors, but thats why I call it "professionalism".
Amateurs are there for the fun and to mess around with the occasional fight when (if) they can get their shit together. Professionals are there to fight on time, every time..
After running a few events, you get an idea of who can be counted on to go when they are asked, and who is always still reassembling or repairing their bot 2 minutes after they have been called to the arena.
I understand unexpected things can happen on occasion - it happened to me at RoboWars II - I thought I had I.G. all ready to fight again, but a motor that *was* working when I tested it had cooled down and the melted internal plastic fan had then solidified inside and jammed it. It worked when still warm when I tested it..
I only discovered it when demonstrating the drive-adapters to Glen (thanks Glen) and found one wheel couldnt move. Which then took me over an hour to fix.. Had that happened in the arena, I would have lost or forfeited. Mel lost a match with Scoopy because she didnt discover a dead drive motor until she was in the arena.
Anyway, enough ranting. Rearranging the competition structure wont change the entrants habits.. You need to either get tough on the forfeits, or kick some butt of the late runners. _________________ Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people
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Tue May 30, 2006 3:22 pm |
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chrisjon65
Experienced Roboteer
Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 754
Location: blaxland
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all these ideas have their merits ,and trust me ill go eitherway ,but i cant see us even getting close to any of them until the turn around time between battles is adressed .
i like the statement brett made about being proffesional in your approach to a battle day . call it proffesional if you like ,to me its common courtesy.
and yes dont leave your robot till its locked and loaded for the next round .
and as ive said before ,if you had your bum whipped and your robot is buggered ,do the right thing and forfiet ,then people doing the draws etc know whats happening and can move on .
i recall at our 2nd round ,it took us till 11-30 am to have our first round due to late commers ,uncharged batteries ,still grinding etc etc .but amazingly we managed to get through all the battles and the mellee by 4-30pm why????
because everyone got stuck in and was proffesional about it .to me that was the best days battling ive seen us have .
its about preparation before the event at home the hours ,days and weeks before battling .
if you just want to do robots on the day of an event and no more then stay home and dont waste everyones time
once these issues are adressed and we can run a one on one day smoothly i cant see us battling as often as we would using other criteria.
i would love the pool system and the RR system but think of what we do now and fix it first .end of rant
_________________ Photos - http://community.webshots.com/album/154092733uokpXC
Photos- http://community.webshots.com/album/166819552PDWWqP
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Sat Jun 03, 2006 9:22 am |
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